...missed the MAIN points ... very naive ... instructed to Get real! You're 3 posts into the board and you know everything about everybody here.

Big news ... NASCAR institutes claiming rule for 2010 season ...

Phil Parsons claims the 48 after its victory at Michigan in June. Eagerly, Phil rushes the car to his shop to begin preparing it for Sonoma. Absent the simulation, shaker rig and Vehicular Inertial Measurement Machine data and the Sonoma setup sheets derived from said data, Phil presses forward using his own notes. He does not own any simulation software, a shaker rig or a VIMM, nor does he employ anyone capable of operating them.

Phil's team freshens the engine and wonders what cylinder heads, pistons, connecting rod length, camshaft, valve train geometry, intake manifold and exhaust headers Chad would have used for Sonoma. They time the Michigan cam from info gathered from Phil's notes. No matter ... 850 hp is good enough for any track.

The 48 team, having had all its cars claimed after 15 races, claims the #34 Bob Jenkins Chevrolet, ably driven to a 33rd place finish by John Andretti. Chad whips that jewel into the shop, strips it bare, has it wrapped in the 48 Lowe's livery, outfits it with all the parts and the engine he has ready for Sonoma, sets it up with the data he acquired 3 weeks ago off the sims and the machines and gives it a quick shake to make sure it's ready. He spends his evenings at home, running Sonoma strategy logarithms on his PC.

Onward to California ...

We're naive?

#1 Anyone thinking a 'Leased' car or motor from a big name is the exact same as team car is VERY naive. The tricks aren't in rentals.

They HAVE to be, or they will lose all of their business. You don't get Chad Knause's setup, but you get the SAME PIECES. Ask Tony Stewart.

#2 Put JJ, Jeff, Mark, & Dale Jr in Norm Benning cars. Does anyone Really believe they'd still win? Get real!

Put Tony Stewart in Scott Riggs car and Darian Grubb calling the shots, and it goes from 34th in points to 5th with 4 wins. Get Real!

NASCAR won't admit they still have 3 tiers of teams and until we, the ticket buyers/TV watchers, speak up the status quo will remain and next year probably a 5th straight championship.

And you know what? THAT'S RACING.

When Hendrick started out, he didn't have two nickles to rub together. He worked harder, hired the right people, and they worked harder and smarter than everyone else. Same with Gibbs, same with Childress. They didn't BUY anything, they worked for it. That's how you're suppose to be successful in America. Problem is, if you're TOO successful, that makes you bad.

Only in America.

auntysquat - 18 November 2009 10:50 AM

...missed the MAIN points ... very naive ... instructed to Get real! You're 3 posts into the board and you know everything about everybody here.

Big news ... NASCAR institutes claiming rule for 2010 season ...

Phil Parsons claims the 48 after its victory at Michigan in June. Eagerly, Phil rushes the car to his shop to begin preparing it for Sonoma. Absent the simulation, shaker rig and Vehicular Inertial Measurement Machine data and the Sonoma setup sheets derived from said data, Phil presses forward using his own notes. He does not own any simulation software, a shaker rig or a VIMM, nor does he employ anyone capable of operating them.

Phil's team freshens the engine and wonders what cylinder heads, pistons, connecting rod length, camshaft, valve train geometry, intake manifold and exhaust headers Chad would have used for Sonoma. They time the Michigan cam from info gathered from Phil's notes. No matter ... 850 hp is good enough for any track.

The 48 team, having had all its cars claimed after 15 races, claims the #34 Bob Jenkins Chevrolet, ably driven to a 33rd place finish by John Andretti. Chad whips that jewel into the shop, strips it bare, has it wrapped in the 48 Lowe's livery, outfits it with all the parts and the engine he has ready for Sonoma, sets it up with the data he acquired 3 weeks ago off the sims and the machines and gives it a quick shake to make sure it's ready. He spends his evenings at home, running Sonoma strategy logarithms on his PC.

Onward to California ...

We're naive?

Definately +1 posting of the day!

Judging a person's rational or knowledge by 'number of posts' - childish.
I see fanatics rule otherwise a description of ABNORMAL USER wouldn't be so overused in forum member ranking.
Guess a discussion re: Claiming is like talking to The All Knowing. And I'll wager none have scrubbed rubber.

Judging a person's rational or knowledge by 'number of posts' - childish.

No-one did that. There's no way for any of us to know how much knowledge you possess. I said: "You're 3 posts into the board and you know everything about everybody here." That refers to what you know or don't know about the people you refer to as naive, not bright enough to get your simplistic point and who need to get real. As for the rationale behind your premise ... it wouldn't matter to anyone if you had made it on your first post or your 5,000th - it's weak, unworkable and ignores competitive and economic reality.

I see fanatics rule otherwise a description of ABNORMAL USER wouldn't be so overused in forum member ranking.

The terms rookie, legend, speed freak, fanatic and abnormal user are assigned to users of the board by the software, dependent upon usage of the board. None of us have anything to do with that and couldn't change our designation if we wanted to. You're new and unaware of that ... understandable. Please stop referring to people as fanatics and abnormal users.

Guess a discussion re: Claiming is like talking to The All Knowing.

Hardly. It's quite common to have people disagree with other people here and elsewhere. Some people are more knowledgeable than others. Some people with 3 posts are brilliant. Others with 5,000 plus are not ... kinda like in the real world.

And I'll wager none have scrubbed rubber.

I've never heard that term before ... must be a regional thing - I've never heard it used in the Pacific NorthWest racing community.

If you bet money that nobody here has a racing background, you'd lose. Were you to wager that I've never worked in a carwash, you would be a big winner.

No-one's disrespecting you personally, which is surprising given the tone you used. Stick around and go posting on the NASCAR Discussion Board. It's a lot of fun ... tread lightly at first and I'm sure everyone there, including myself, will welcome you.

Have a great day.

Claiming rules are a Red Herring.

The teams that have the financial wherewithal to develop 'secrets' also have the financial wherewithal to play the claiming 'game' to protect those secrets.

Claiming is common in horse racing, too. To me, it seems like a great way to use market forces to control costs, where the rules are pretty specific in dictating the equipment, i.e., lots of interchangeability. Another way of looking at it, is to prevent sandbagging. In the horse racing world, it separates lower tiers and prevents owners from "dropping" a class to get easy wins. So, from that perspective, it doesn't make sense at the top level.

The claiming rule would work great in the IRL. But even if you had a Penske or Ganassi car,there's a shop full of replacements. The IRL cars are all the same, you can get the car but you can't have the notebook with all the good stuff in it.

Here is why it wouldn't work in NASCAR

1. Engines, Chassis, Bodies would only be claimed by those within their manufacutre anyway

2. With the way the rules are now, 95% of the body needs to be replaced anyway after your average race. The cost of that plus the cost of the claim will make the "little team gets an advantage" point void.

3. Shocks, Springs, Gears, Transmissions, brakes, etc are all specific brands for each team.

4. Most of those pieces really only get a race out of them before they get put into the "test/show-car" rotation. A low-budget team would be better off saving money and buying a new motor then they would buying a Hendrick motor that just ran the entire Coke 600 weekend.

5. Say some S&P;team goes out and claims a big teams car, what is to stop that big team next week from having all 4 of their "teams" each claim an S&P;car to send the message of "Don't F*** with us"

Claiming is a game....it does nothing to even the comptition.