http://tsn.ca/auto_racing/story/?id=283333

INDIANAPOLIS -- Tony George's tenure as the leader of U.S. open-wheel racing and its biggest stage, the Indianapolis Motor Speedway, was marked by tumultuous changes. Now George himself is being replaced -- at the behest of a board led by his mother....

To answer the question...in my opinion neither. The only thing that will bring F1 back to IMS is a lowering of the extortion. The Indianapolis Motor Speedway will NOT host an event and pay Bernie for the privilege of losing money. I'm doubtful any US track would....would you?

If Tony George's "resignation" from the IMS management has any effect on Formula One, it will make the series even more difficult to bring back to the speedway. As BlackDuck59 said, Tony's little venture into the "Big Time" world of Formula One cost the speedway millions. First, there was the infield road course, with all its safety features. Then there were the posh new grages, press facilities, etc., that the F1 crowd demanded. (Why they couldn't use the IRL/NASCAR pits and Gasoline Alley, both of which have served the speedway for 90 years, I don't know, but that's Formula One for you...)

Then there was thte cost of actually staging the race. Bernie demanded his fee for the race date. Then he demaded more money for the teams to show up -- appearance money, transportation fund, etc.

Then, of course, the television deal, which is legalized larceny. Not only does Bernie charge the speedway owners millions to televise the race, he turns around and sells the footage to the world's networks for even more millions. Meanwhile, he demands half the gate recipts and leaves Tony and company with not much more than the beer money.

Hardly encouragement to bring Formula One back again, when you total up the costs and losses. I think the only reason the series is still alive is because there are third-world governments who will pay anything for the "prestige" of holding a race, no matter what it costs. Meanwhile, France is without a Grand Prix, as are San Marino, Holland and Belgium. Germany may be next on the "can't afford list," and there is Britain, which may or may not host another F1 race, depending on how deep Donnington Park's pockets are.

Would other U.S. tracks be willing to host a Grand Prix? It depends on the deal. If they get the same respect -- and money -- NASCAR, the IRL, the ALMS and CART give them, maybe. All those series pay for the privilege of running on the tracks, and the organizers make their own television deals, which usually involve the TV people paying the track for the right to broadcast the race.

And if they don't? Well, I heard a rumour that some years back, Bernie approached Mid-Ohio about hosting a Grand Prix. The track owners looked at what Bernie demanded versus what he wanted and said, "no thank you." Or something to that effect, in a more heated dialect of "Americanese." Suffice it to say, The Evil Elf is not a welcome sight around here.

GreyWolf74 - 30 June 2009 11:34 PM

If Tony George's "resignation" from the IMS management has any effect on Formula One, it will make the series even more difficult to bring back to the speedway. As BlackDuck59 said, Tony's little venture into the "Big Time" world of Formula One cost the speedway millions. First, there was the infield road course, with all its safety features. Then there were the posh new grages, press facilities, etc., that the F1 crowd demanded. (Why they couldn't use the IRL/NASCAR pits and Gasoline Alley, both of which have served the speedway for 90 years, I don't know, but that's Formula One for you...)

Then there was thte cost of actually staging the race. Bernie demanded his fee for the race date. Then he demaded more money for the teams to show up -- appearance money, transportation fund, etc.

Then, of course, the television deal, which is legalized larceny. Not only does Bernie charge the speedway owners millions to televise the race, he turns around and sells the footage to the world's networks for even more millions. Meanwhile, he demands half the gate recipts and leaves Tony and company with not much more than the beer money.

Hardly encouragement to bring Formula One back again, when you total up the costs and losses. I think the only reason the series is still alive is because there are third-world governments who will pay anything for the "prestige" of holding a race, no matter what it costs. Meanwhile, France is without a Grand Prix, as are San Marino, Holland and Belgium. Germany may be next on the "can't afford list," and there is Britain, which may or may not host another F1 race, depending on how deep Donnington Park's pockets are.

Would other U.S. tracks be willing to host a Grand Prix? It depends on the deal. If they get the same respect -- and money -- NASCAR, the IRL, the ALMS and CART give them, maybe. All those series pay for the privilege of running on the tracks, and the organizers make their own television deals, which usually involve the TV people paying the track for the right to broadcast the race.

And if they don't? Well, I heard a rumour that some years back, Bernie approached Mid-Ohio about hosting a Grand Prix. The track owners looked at what Bernie demanded versus what he wanted and said, "no thank you." Or something to that effect, in a more heated dialect of "Americanese." Suffice it to say, The Evil Elf is not a welcome sight around here.

Holland hasn't hosted an F1 grand prix in 24 years, the San Marino Grand Prix was in name only, it was held in Italy. I doubt F1 will come back for the simple fact that no independent track owner is going to pay an F1 sanctioning fee, Bernie or no Bernie. The market for F1 Grand Prix's has a very long list even before Bernie jacked up the rates to $35 million. Unfortunately Tony George was willing to break just to bring F1 to Indy, in fact the ticket prices were alot lower than what it costs to attend a NASCAR race.

GreyWolf74 - 30 June 2009 11:34 PM

...the IRL, the ALMS and CART give them, maybe. All those series pay for the privilege of running on the tracks

You've said this a few times, and it's simply not true, at least not for IRL. (Nor CART when it existed. Don't know about ALMS.) The promoter pays a sanctioning fee. IRL does not get paid much for the TV rights, so that money doesn't go to the tracks, and the tracks certainly aren't negotiating their own TV deals.

Bernie's biggest offenses from a track owner's point of view, apart from the extortionate sanctioning fee, are taking a cut of the gate, and taking the trackside signage. Those things should belong to the track.

I live in Indianapolis and I'm thrilled that Tony George is out of the picture I haven't went back to the speedway ever sense F-1 left and I'm hoping that the new crew brings it back to us I think that is my only hope, Now the split of the FIA and the FOTA not going to happen from the way it looks.The news that the FOTA was going to bring a race back I was thrilled.But I think and hope there is a good chance it will come back.

The articles I have read about Tony's ouster focused mostly about his spending the money necessary for events such as the USGP.

I view the new leadership as being more tight fisted with the finances and as long as Bernie want a key and unfettered access to a countries treasury....we will never see another USGP at Indy.

I have no love lost for TG and the IRL. That being said he has been the only one crazy enough, and fan enough, to try to bring Grand Prix racing back to the US. Whether the track layout was all it could have been or not is immaterial....TG did bring the Grand Prix to the US, until such time as he could no longer financially respond to Bernie's insatiable demands.

The REAL help would be Bernie's and CVC's exit...

GreyWolf74 - 30 June 2009 11:34 PM

And if they don't? Well, I heard a rumour that some years back, Bernie approached Mid-Ohio about hosting a Grand Prix. The track owners looked at what Bernie demanded versus what he wanted and said, "no thank you." Or something to that effect, in a more heated dialect of "Americanese." Suffice it to say, The Evil Elf is not a welcome sight around here.

What!?

I know for a fact Bernie never approached Mid-Ohio about hosting an F1 race. I think the good folks at Mid-Ohio once went on record as saying "if" Bernie ever approached them, there was no way they could afford to bring their facility, which is already very nice to begin with, up to their crazy lofty standards, let alone swing the sanction fee.

spacepig - 01 July 2009 08:33 AM

GreyWolf74 - 30 June 2009 11:34 PM

...the IRL, the ALMS and CART give them, maybe. All those series pay for the privilege of running on the tracks

You've said this a few times, and it's simply not true, at least not for IRL. (Nor CART when it existed. Don't know about ALMS.) The promoter pays a sanctioning fee. IRL does not get paid much for the TV rights, so that money doesn't go to the tracks, and the tracks certainly aren't negotiating their own TV deals.

Bernie's biggest offenses from a track owner's point of view, apart from the extortionate sanctioning fee, are taking a cut of the gate, and taking the trackside signage. Those things should belong to the track.

It's not true for NASCAR either, and I highly doubt it is for ALMS. Every half-respectable series has a sanctioning fee-sure, we can all agree that F1's is far too high, but it's not like it's the only series that has one.

Didn't the local government offer to help George bring the race back and he refused? Maybe the new team will be open to it.