ok ive been a fan since the late 60's...so i know the "sport"...with all the advances in safety equipment...etc ....i have watched just this weekend past too many cars destroyed by blown tires and the aftermath of debris.....i propose to NASCAR.....for 09....that all 4 tires be enclosed by a fixed welded to the frame steel fender liner....dont care about the weight issue...that can be compensated for elsewhere..or might not be an issue anyway....its rediculous that a tire failure on one car can take out sooo many others....its uncalled for and needs to be addressed..anything heavier than "tin/aluminium" would be better than what we witnessed at 'dega!.....im thinkin that the "wheelhouse" should be part of the frame...tubeing should be welded to the chasis....and formed around the whole perimeter/circumference of the tire..sort of on the line of a "rollcage" for the tire..with steel welded to the underside so it won't launch out (be contained) when a tire "blows"....i would like to hear your opinion....and if anyone from nascar reads this and considers it ...remember where the suggestion came from...A FAN FOR MANY MANY YEARS!...do you here me gary nelson?...robin pemberton?....helton?...brian?...brett ?....darby?....what do you think?

Since you already posted this in the Wind Tunnel section, I'm just going to copy/paste my answer.

The bodies are made of steel. 24 gauge sheet metal to be exact.

Though I had considered adding a layer of protection around the wheel well myself, I would have gone with kevlar.

mustang6172 - 07 October 2008 04:34 PM

Since you already posted this in the Wind Tunnel section, I'm just going to copy/paste my answer.

The bodies are made of steel. 24 gauge sheet metal to be exact.

Though I had considered adding a layer of protection around the wheel well myself, I would have gone with kevlar.

Wouldn't matter, the amount you'd have to add to contain WITHOUT damage would be prohibitive. Part of racing, not going to happen. We could race M1A1's if you want invulnerability. AA JMHO

Bill

The containment suggested would add a few hundred pounds to an already obese platform. Such an arrangement would not always contain the 180 mph flying belt of steel, fabric and rubber. On the occasions that it did, the suspension and brake systems on that corner would be severely damaged at significant cost to the team. I fail to see a valid reason for such a system. Apparently the sanctioning body and the teams don't see one either.

If you want to see a dangerous situation properly contained, take a look at the driveshaft tunnel in the COT.

Back to Black - 07 October 2008 06:58 PM

The containment suggested would add a few hundred pounds to an already obese platform. Such an arrangement would not always contain the 180 mph flying belt of steel, fabric and rubber. On the occasions that it did, the suspension and brake systems on that corner would be severely damaged at significant cost to the team. I fail to see a valid reason for such a system. Apparently the sanctioning body and the teams don't see one either.

If you want to see a dangerous situation properly contained, take a look at the driveshaft thanx for your response.....i understand the bodies bein steel..... what im talkin about is a heavier gauge....... how many races have we watched were the "tins" get blown out and drivers are subjected to fumes and such....its a garbage excuse in my opinion!......and after the blow outs of the past week end and all the residual debris causeing damage..look what the nhra did after darrel russel..all of a sudden the back of the head has a sheild?.........my point is that if they used a cage built off of the frame...(just like the roll bar in construction) the tire would be contained to a certain degree and not explode and rip off the whole back half of the car..thus they might not have to go to a back up car because of the devestation..outside of the current frame/greenhouse as we know it theres nothin to contain a tire explodin?......just tin!......and with all the effort that goes into areo bodies and wind tunnel exspenses?..lets bring the little guys back in the picture.....do you want to see 3 owners?...not me......i called this a few years ago ......the france sell out to the media.....and i ended up gettin bounced off the boards! ....i said it was goin to go the route of the wwf of racin and based on what i read here it has!.its not racin its a show.....orchestrated bull sh&t;...because of brians sellout..if it were up to me it be back on tnt...and espn ....w/ned and buddytunnel in the COT.

so if the tires explode and half the body is ripped off its not a major cost?......and as far as weight issues...they could adjust the restrictor plate to compensate for that...and how many times must we see lead weights flyin around after a crash?....sorry but i honestly think that what i propose would greatly reduce catastophic damage and be safer for all the cars in the field........tin aint gonna cut it no more....when body panels were sailin into the stands and killin people they put tethers on them.....why not do the same with the tires?..all im sayin is to extend the frame rails so they encapsolate the tire..make it so a explostion of a tire won't take out half the field or prevent a team from comin back into the race?

I didn't say that one form of damage was more or less expensive than the other. The point is that either is race-ending or race-killing for the team. I can't recall the last time I saw any ballast flying around. Perhaps you have a point ... I'm not seeing it, but that doesn't mean it's not valid or that it isn't a good idea.

Good points and good ideas are easily lost in off-topic rants like the one above your latest post. If you stick to the topic (which you started, btw) people will be more inclined to have a discussion with you. I'm really not at all interested in the good old days/wwf/France bashing or any of that crap. I was around then ... many things were different. Some were better - a great many were not. Let's stay in the present, shall we?

How would you like to be a Crew Chief. Every Race NASCAR Tries a New Tire Type or Compound. As the Chief your Notes are Junk. Your Not sure if the tire will run 12 Laps or 50 laps. Like today at Lowe's they ran a New Compound. Jr. was telling His Crew Chief a Play to Play when a right tire Blew up again. Ho Hint. They found a Cut from the track. I wonder why they don't run Tread like INDI cars run 2 or 3 groves. It's like they are running Drag Slicks. 1/8 thick. If they would go to just 3 compounds. I think the Crew Chiefs would & could Keep Notes. They all say the Lowe's always run Right side Front tire Hot faster. It's Like driving a Brick. Everyone wonders why so many of the Older drivers can't get a win. Tony, Gordon, Martin, all drivers that have run the Old Cup cars for so many Years. I think that they just don't know what feel to-get. The Younger Drivers or the Young Guns have only run the Old cup cars for at the Most 3 to 4 years. So it's Much easer for them to change a Habit or Feel.

It might be time to let or mandate tire air censors in the wheels plus bleeders so teems or NASCAR could set max air pressure. So we will not hear my right rear might be going down, it would be I've lost 2 lbs in my right rear that last lap. I think this might cut down on wrecks and yellows.

mike fitzpatrick - 14 October 2008 11:14 PM

It might be time to let or mandate tire air censors in the wheels plus bleeders so teems or NASCAR could set max air pressure. So we will not hear my right rear might be going down, it would be I've lost 2 lbs in my right rear that last lap. I think this might cut down on wrecks and yellows.

Brilliant! I could never get my head around the idea that NASCAR refused to allow the use of bleeders. The air pressure sensors would add another layer of safety and surely NASCAR could get past their traction control mental block and realize that it would be a simple matter to police their use.

I would be all for bleeders. I think the amount of money they would save on crashes from tire failures would outweigh the cost of technology. Air pressure sensors may be not be necessary. All they really measure is how much a tire sags and watches for sudden changes.