Whats wrong with American Honda and Yamaha USA why are they uncompetative in AMA SuperBike racing when Ten Kate Honda and Yamaha Motor Italia are extreamly competative in World SuperBike racing.American Suzuki and Kawasaki USA are getting better results then their WSB teams in Europe what is wrong with Honda and Yamaha.I have read they both have gotten help and advice from their WSBK teams in Europe is it bad management incompetent crew are is it the riders.I think in Yamahas case it may be the mangement are the crew because their bikes were 10 mph slower then the other factory bikes in Ohio and Haga's Yamaha had the highest top speed at Brans Hatch.America Honda has had alot of mechanical problems this year so it might be their crew but I do think they should have replaced Duhamel with Josh Hayes this year and his results have been worse than Hudgson every race.

Well, for one thing, as teams I think both WSBK teams have better riders. Hodgson is very good. I'm glad Honda sighned him. I mentioned on another thread that I think Miguel should be replaced. Hayes would be my pick as well. Eric Bostrom is a proven winner and I don't know who would replace him, so I can't call for his head. DiSalvo on the other hand hasn't impressed me much. I haven't checked the results, but I'm pretty sure Bostrom is routinely ahead of him. Again, I don't know who would replace him, but I just don't see him winning many races (if any) on the SBK.

Don't know! Need some inside scoop to sort that out. Greg White? Do your job. Inquiring fans need to know. The riders make a difference a lot. However, that doesn't account for the differences you are discussing. #### good question if ya ask me!

ilthomson - 06 August 2008 10:54 AM

I haven't checked the results, but I'm pretty sure Bostrom is routinely ahead of him. Again, I don't know who would replace him, but I just don't see him winning many races (if any) on the SBK.

Disalvo is ahead 339 to EBoz's 311. JD has been racing better than Bostrom this season. I think Eric is qualifying better but dropping back in the race. It's hard to know what or who is the reason the other bikes aren't doing as well. Presumably Aaron Yates and Tommy Hayden had the same bike as Mladin & Spies. Those guys may have been 3rd but there was still a gap.

I'd like to blame the track layouts but the AMA had good racing before the past 4 years. WSB and the AMA made sure there where no direct comparison between top bikes at Miller so again it's hard to know.

Let's not forget this is motorcycle racing and the rider makes all the difference. It's the 80/20 rule: Rider is 80%, bike 20%. Spies and Mladin are just hungrier now. They're pushing each other. Like someone said, T. Hayden is on the same bike, so what's his story?? He must not be as hungry. Hodgson, Duhamel, EBoz are all former winners and champions, but that 20% needed from the bike is letting them down. It's a very fine line.

Hacking seems hungry and look at his results, getting better all the time. Yates seems as hungry as ever.

Same thing in motocross right now - Tim Ferry is on the exact same bike as James Stewart, but Stewart consistently smokes everyone, every race because he's hungry and must want it more. So much of racing is mental, between the ears.

This isn't stupid car racing where you could just flip that ratio around - car 80%, guy 20.

I think it pure and simple,Yosh has built the best bike,and they have the best 2 riders on the grid.That makes for an unbeatable combo.WSB has more quality riders by a long shot and the spec tire,as much as i hate it,does seem to bring the bikes closer together.One thing both series needs to address is the fact that both series are getting long in the tooth.With Spies set to leave after this year,what is the average age of the next best riders.Mladin,Hacking,Duhamel,Hodgson,Yates,Hayden are not spring chickens.Same thing with WSB,Bayliss retiring
Corser,Biaggi,Haga,all the stars are getting old.What youngster is set to take the lead in WSB,not inherit it as the old guys retire.At the start of this year,i would have said Josh Herrin was the next to challenge the Yosh juggernaut in AMA,but he has gone backwards this year and seems to have shrunk into Bostroms shadow,regularly finishing outside the top 5.

I think Yamahas down fall started when their boss Keith McCarty told the DMG he wanted rules closer to SuperStock next year because their results have gotten worse ever since after a good start from Disalvo.They were getting parts from Yamaha Motor Italia and they were improving but ever since McCarty'sugestion they have been running at the back of the factory bikes and i read an interview from Disalvo they have no new parts to test.

I think it all comes down to money. Yosh/Suzuki and Kawasaki are willing to spend the bucks to build competitive teams. Honda pulled back for budgetary reasons a few years ago (quit leasing bikes from HRC, etc....)and they haven't been truly competitive since. Yamaha appears to me to want to keep costs as low as possible. They were the only OEM that was fine with the DMG changes and the only one that wasn't part of the MIC/OEM breakaway series discussions (as well as just getting back into the superbike class a year or two ago). I think it is the same in WSBK, Kawi doesn't seem to put the money into the program the others do. Suzuki has been succesful, Corser won the title a couple of years back and Neukirchner is right up there this year.

If you don't spend the money on development then you won't get the ponies/speed to catch up to the quick teams.

As far as riders it does seem to be the over the hill club in AMA. There were a couple of guys who showed promise over the last few years (Geoff May, Danny Eslick, Josh Herrin, Aaron Gobert, Ben Attard, Vincent Haskovic, etc....) but none of them have panned out or they were injured. Same goes for WSBK, Sofoglu has had a terrible year (personal and professional).

Not that I will begrudge them, it's just too bad a lot of these guys were not able to escape the AMA's paycheck gravity pull. With Hodgson as the only real guage, as he's been the only international champion on top equipment here, the AMA regulars are doing pretty well. That's sad, because Hayes and Zemke probably could have mad a serious mark in WSB.

Who would they have had to beat? Bayliss and Toseland. Toseland was able to beat Bayliss last year. The year before that Barros came into the series and was fast right away on a substandard bike. Ben Bostrom may have scared a few Americans away but he was also on a bad bike in his last WSB attempt and couldn't do anything.

Haga is one of the fastest riders in the world but he still makes stupid mistakes (crashes on his own) and is not consistant enough to be champion. Corser is hot and cold. The rest of the WSB field bar a few are definitly no better than Hayes, Zemke or Hacking.

Are we comparing Zemke and Barros?? Sorry but I don't see it. Zemke may be a great rider but he has a long way to go before he can be compared with a guy who has won GPs and podiumed on a satellite Ducati last season.

garyb425 - 06 August 2008 01:55 PM

Are we comparing Zemke and Barros?? Sorry but I don't see it. Zemke may be a great rider but he has a long way to go before he can be compared with a guy who has won GPs and podiumed on a satellite Ducati last season.

Yes, I am comparing Zemke to Barros on WSB machines. Barros hasn't won and AMA races. Not one! How bad does he suck? Seriously look at what I am saying. It's not a stretch. I used Zemke as an example but put what ever top AMA rider if you like. ON WSB BIKES, and over the entire season Josh Hayes, Hacking and espeically Spies can run with the top guys over there.

Biaggi, Barros and Check were the top guys of MotoGP whether you agree or not. There is even talk about Biaggi going back (not going to happen). Outside of those three no other MotoGP rider has come to WSB and made an impact. Racing, no matter what class you are in requires the right bike, rider and team.